Martha, I am in no way trying to start any problems with or for you. I am happy to see people stand up for their children. There was a time when I stood up for someone else’s child who was being publicly abused by the parent, who btw, was at least 6′4″ to my 5′6″. There were dozens of people laying around enjoying the spectacle. Not bragging, but giving an example of how much I do not like to see children being abused.

But, if I were, I could be very upset by your remarks. See post #60.

Once your awareness is raised you would be amazed at how easy it is make the adjustment.

If nothing else, it sounds very condescending, and presumptuous. But, I can let it go in view of the fact that you don’t know me, and either are ignoring my other posts or simply haven’t had occasion to read them.

However, a lot of this is beyond me. As an artist, I am aware of color as a way of looking at everything. People aren’t black or white in color. They aren’t red or yellow. I think it’s insulting to paint every race with a color name and then put that on every individual of that race. We all know that people of all races come in various shades of brown to beige with some having a bit more pink or gold and even greens and blue tinges to their skin. It has nothing to do with black, white, red, yellow, brown. What, are we children who are first learning our primary and secondary colors and cannot be trusted with the tertiaries? Please. The system is even more prejudice making, imho.

I still don’t see any official document by a recognized authority. We as a country have long ago released the intentionally insulting words that I won’t even print out here. We all know what they were. Other than that,
I am not going to automatically obey some people who either disagree with my views politically or otherwise on this forum, or any other.

Last night the Council tried to “clean up its act”. Unfortunately, they seemed to only further “muddy the waters”. (see my comment of Oct 4, 11:19 am for some history, so I don’t have to re-explain)

It appears, according to MN state statute 410,12, subd.7, that the council was in violation of this statute by not voting on the charter amendment proposal within a month after the public hearing. A bizarrely comic/tragic discussion occurred, in which the City Attorney advised the councilors that it really didn’t matter, they were just a little bit late, (Sept 15 - Oct 6) and they should just go ahead and vote (sort of in the spirit of “better late than never”)!

!!!! ??? **** (These in place of an oft used three letter phrase, ending with a possibly unacceptable word)

So, after “sort of fighting” with the Charter Commission over this hospital amendment issue for some months (although the hospital board had sent a letter approving the wording), and then refusing to even discuss it at the Sept. 15 meeting (letting it die for lack of a second), resulting in violating a state statute, they now are told they can fix it all by just voting, so they do, and vote it down.

You cannot blame this one on Mr. Roder, although an ( possibly arrogant ?) attitude lingers. I am reminded of the the meeting last summer when Councilor Davis said: “We’re not breaking any rules; we’re just making up our own!”

Yup … I think that was a correct analysis.

Can I go home now?

Next time, I’ll pull the ambush the handicapable card.

” I did say ‘it is’, not’ your posts are’”

Bright, I assume you are referring to your sentence “It’s very divisive” in posting #61. What is the antecedent of “it” there?

I am not referring to the etymology of the phrase and, I know that you certainly did not intend it as a slur.

I am merely communicating the education and awareness that has been shared with me by those who do take offense by the use of these phrases.

I think Barry has hit the nail on the head by stating, “… words do acquire new connotations, new meanings, and new referent.” I know this to be the case.

I point it out as an opportunity to learn.

Anybody, I would like to see a list or book or some offical list of things people cannot legally say and where some official book like the dictionary, which I know lags behind usage, but really the only standardized way of going about educating the adult population. I go by the dictionary for most of my understanding of words I am only partly familiar with. Even there, ‘black list’ is not a problematic or racist phrase.

I have just spent ten minutes looking for a PC list and find only bits and pieces and mostly anti PC comments.

“what do I call the stuff I use to color my face part?”

Assuming it’s a shade of red, how about “republicanizer”? And maybe a little blue democratizer around the eyes….

However, now, what do I call the stuff I use to color my face part?

Etymology aside, though, words do acquire new connotations, new meanings, and new referents. It’s impossible anymore, for example, to hear the word “lipstick” and not immediately think of pigs, pitbulls, and Sarah Palin. To the extent we wish to make our ideas clear to others, it’s important to understand how others understand our words.

Instead of trying to get everyone to change innocent language, I would spend the time teaching children that there are no words on the planet that should make them feel less than any other being. I would spend the time telling children that this is not a world full of people who with every utterance are putting them down, just because they are describing a situation that has nothing to do with who they are. It’s very divisive. IT makes your best allies afraid to speak. No one is calling your children or any children bad names. Really.

If someone here spews racist crap, I will be in the forefront of people who support you and your family. I Promise. Double Promise.

I respectfully disagree with you. Words do matter and can be judgemental. Once your awareness is raised you would be amazed at how easy it is make the adjustment.

The effect of network and distributive governance is to bring more people into the process, who are closer to the place where initiatives are applied. It helps effectiveness by granting them the ability to make real decisions, not just offer advice, while providing governance through stakeholder oversight.

A Strong Mayor system at the council level, in combination with networked and distributive governance, would allow the directly elected officials to more efficiently define, articulate and fund a vision.

Decisions in this model are improved via direct feedback from the stakeholders who evaluate the performance of the groups who have been empowered to take actions and swift corrective or supportive action at the mayor/council level.

There are many more people involved in this kind of a system and it can be both more efficient and more effective.

However, I am interested in your source of that etymological basis for the phrase “black mark”, as I can only find it being first used in the time of Charles II in England, as a way of defining lists of royalist supporters, or adversaries.

( Sorry to be so pedantic, but coming from a household with a grandfather who was a linguist speaking 17 languages, and where word origins were a dinner table game, I am always curious.)

Just a little reminder:

The terminology “black mark” is negative racial term. Using the phrase “another negative mark” avoids equating black with bad or as a negative.

I want other readers to understand where I am coming from on the use of color descriptors when communicating. I am the mother of a black child and a biracial child. I know first hand how these color descriptors can hurt a child’s self-image.

Thanks for understanding.

I would cite the City’s new rental code as an example. Isn’t that a case where the City government should have “distributed” the job of managing unruly tenants to the citizens?

At the next Chart/Com. meeting, the commission voted (5-2) to shut down until next February. I would presume this was because of the council’s action, and the commission’s presumption that it was best to wait for a new council (one not so adversarial with the Charter Commission?) to try to accomplish any further amendments, or new proposals.

I have never understood the negative reaction of some of the council to the Charter Commission, and I think it is just another “black mark” on this council’s record. If there are sincere differences of opinion, they should be discussed. This hospital amendment had a letter of approval from the hospital board.

Letting a proposal from a board/commission die for want of a second is an inappropriate power play. How was this consensus achieved?

The resulting action of the CharterCommission (shutting down til a new council comes on) was a pragmatic choice, but in my mind, an unfortunate one.

At any rate, the proposal is back on the council’s regular agenda this week, presumably at the Mayor’s behest … what will happen?

Someone Should be the Leader

Who Will be the Leader?

Investing in Leaders

How do we know if we have good governance?

Improving Governance through Competition and Distribution

I hope that these were at least helpful in stirring some discussion and consideration. I am also hopeful that “discussion and consideration” will not be where we stop. There is a need for change and I hope that our charter commission and future mayor, adminstrator and council will change how we are governed.