Let’s put this discussion to sleep and vow to be on the alert for ways in which our own ‘inner snob’ can sneak out and get in the way of problem-solving and community-building. Antidote: humility.

Comments are now turned off.

KIFFI
P.S. That means you ought to end it, Griff.

Going back to Griff’s original thread, (heck, after 155 posts, why not?) no one has proposed an antidote to snobbishness. I have one, but I’m sure it will stir up a hornets’ nest if I suggest it. But then, I’m just ornery enough to do that. The weather is warm, and we may as well have a few hornets buzzing.

Phillipians 2 states this,” Have this attitude which was also in Christ Jesus, who, though He existed as God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied Himself and became obedient to death, even death on a cross.” I think that if anyone had a right to look down upon sinful man, it was He, who, according to scripture, was without sin. He chose not to, though, and by His obedience, opened the way for sinful man to come to God. This is the gospel we preach. So, if you have a relationship with God through Jesus, you have the opportunity to embrace this same perspective of yourself toward others. This is the best antidote I have seen for snobbishness. It is called humility.

However, I don’t feel the same about the discussion on this thread. Conversations like this make me feel unwelcome, and as such I don’t think they’re in the best interests of this town. I would hope the town would welcome just about anyone who thought highly enough of Northfield to choose to live here.

My answer is always the same, if you are not honoring yourself, your God/gods, your family, your friends, you are wasting time. And that is the real sadness, the real shame and the real deal of it all.

“Do any of you recognize that you may be a snob?”

Yes, I can be a tremendous snob, depending on the context.

I also think that right now in the U.S. citizens are more intolerant of each other than ever.

If you are against abortion, for whatever reason, you are welcome in the Democratic party--just don’t try to use it to force others to adopt religious law.

You are welcome to attempt to persuade others to your views.

What is most interesting in this thread is how you’all think you know what everybody else is saying better than the ones saying it. It is revealing about your own prejudices and snobbery.

Some claim that they have an affiliation with somewhere else so they are not a Northfield snob. Right.

I went to high school in Faribault and I live in DUNDAS. So there.

The real question to me is: are Northfielder’s really snobs, or are “snobs” in the eyes of the beholder? i.e., do Faribault citizens think Northfielder’s are snobs, and why? Because their mom said so? Because of a personal experience?

What experience do the people on this discussion have of snobbery? Are you snobby to people? How? How do you know if people think you are a snob--do they tell you?

Do any of you recognize that you may be a snob?

So, whether Griff is a progressive liberal elite, self-interested liberal idealist, or a bobo, is not the question. The question is whether there are too many arrogant bobos in town.

If anything, Chris Schon’s comment points out the unfortunate situation that the Democratic party has basically written off everybody with any kind of ethical, moral, or even aesthetic reservations about the practice of abortion.

(Having only the most tangential relationship to the original thread topic.)

Well, if you put it that way, you are saying that is is better to kill a baby who has no defense except Republicans, over a man/woman/soldier who does have other ways to avert death within their grasp.

“Before the Iraq War, Brooks argued forcefully on moral grounds for American military intervention, echoing the belief of neoconservative commentators and political figures that American and British forces would be welcomed as liberators.”

Well, Brooks (born in Canada) needs to get over to Iraq now and personally help clean up the mess he helped create.

Back to Griff’s original post — Anne, you make many good points, though I don’t think Faribault residents’ perception of Northfielders as snobs stems from there being a “small but vocal group of people in Northfield who believe they know what’s best for everyone,” though Northfield residents may have that reaction to such a group. (Isn’t there probably such a group or groups in almost any community?)

I think it does come down to judgments based on educational differences and perhaps voting pattern differences. I do know well-educated people who tend to think less of people who don’t go to college, though I also know plenty who don’t. And I have a perception — I don’t know how accurate — that quite a lot of people who don’t go to college think that those who do are less grounded in what the former, quite reasonably, see as reality, and have a certain amount of scorn for them as a result.

What I’m saying, I guess, is that elements of each community are snobby about the others in their own ways. And it’s probably self-perpetuating, just as children’s games are. Faribault kids grow up “knowing” that Northfielders are over-educated snobs, and Northfielders “know” that Faribault is a less-educated, more blue-collar community. And there’s some truth to both perceptions, but to hold either universally true would be a gross overgeneralization. Does it mean that Northfielders really are more snobby than anyone else? I’m not sure that it does. I expect that just about any time you have clear demographic differences between adjacent communities, these types of feelings are likely to exist. When opportunities arise to build bridges and dispel the stereotypes, let’s take them, but I don’t think it’s our (Northfield’s) issue alone.

Obviously, Americans need more than these two parties to choose from. In what other realm of life do we put with only two options?

Ray, I agree with you 100%. There seems to be no connection with intelligence and politics. Of course there are several ways to interpret that statement.

William, I am trying to say, and will say again, recognizing intelligence (or lack thereof) does not constitute snobbery. Treating people like they deserve less than others is snobbery. Stupid people can be snobs.

I definitely want to provoke discussion when I say the majority of US citizens are less-than-bright. Show me that I am wrong. (For one, YOU are assuming that this is an insult when I think of it as stating an obvious fact--I don’t attach much emotional baggage to it--I don’t know if it is good or bad--maybe the not-so-bright are also very happy.)

If we all try real hard we can remember back to the summer of love (NOT lst year--40 years ago) when we were disillusioned by all of our politicians--liberal and conservatives--and we were going to all join communes and change the world. Many believed the only way to change was through revolution.

In studying democracies, the US is unique in its [past?] ability to make substantial changes without revolution. Well, we better change quick or we are going to lose this republic that we all call home.

It’s good to read so many incisive comments, and thanks for the Alexander Tyler quote: unfortunately, it’s right on the mark.

One point about the “literate cities” citation: the average literacy level of cities that voted for the Democratic presidential candidate in ’04 was higher than that of cities that voted for the Republican. Yes, cities tend to be more liberal than rural areas, but the study looked at diferrences AMONG cities, and found a glaring one.

As for this comment:

“People with degrees tend to be Democratic not necessarily because they are smarter but because higher education is an extension of government and people who succeed there tend to believe government is the answer…”

I could not disagree more vehemently. By this logic, soldiers would tend to vote Democratic because the military is part of the government.

Jane Moline: I appaud your passion; if every US citizen cared as much and saw as clearly, our nation would not be in such trouble.

Nathan…It almost seems like a ‘false-flag’ operation. Unfortunately, it is all too common. I’ll assume your reference to ‘yokels’ was just stirring up the roux.